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Posted by admin in Round Table Cyber Debate on January 25th, 2015
Email Addresses of All Participants Deleted For their Privacy
Col Naeem / Javed Chaudhry Saheb,
The kind of effective force you are talking about can be provided jointly by the Higher Judiciary and the Armed Forces.
As regards educating people and creating awareness is a long drawn process. Immediate remedial action is required. This action should not cause any international uproar resulting in imposition of sanctions.
The need of the hour is get rid of the self-serving corrupt politicians and form a National Unity government of capable and honest technocrats for a period of 2 years. This interim government should have full support of the higher judiciary and the Armed forces.
During the 2-yr period, the technocrat govt should clean up the system and bring in effective reforms in all areas of governance. There should be Summary court trials for corruption as well in order to ensure a total cleanup of the existing system..
I fully agree with you that Army take-over is no solution. We should work on a long-term solution.
====================================================================
On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 12:44 AM, Javed Chaudry <> wrote:
Sir, your message is no different from what most of us in this group seem to be either advancing or supporting. The only question here is what can be done practically?
What we can all do practically is to make people aware of what is the problem, what are the issues and draw a line between the right and the wrong things comparing things with the rest of the world and drawing from history.
A different kind of force and thrust is required to actually get rid of the system and those who sustain it for self-serving reasons. This is the force that we, in this group do not have, hence the things remain in status quo.
Javed Chaudry
Whichever way you look at it; this corrupt and exploitative (feudal) system masquerading as democracy shall have to be dismantled; if we want to survive as a state society.
But an overwhelming majority of our compatriots a
r
e either busy to eke out a living or are blissfully ignorant of the chaos seeps in; to undo us for good.
One thing which is eminently doable is, to at least educate the people out of there obliviousness and apathy; and create
awareness.
Could we agree on this approach; and join hands to do something practical?
==========================================================
Why not start from the right foot? Why not allow only the highly educated and experienced professionals to enter the parliament? Pakistan has plenty of such people available. Why do we not think out of the box and introduce a method to exclude the likes of that garbage that makes the majority of so called Electables. A new system can only emerge from a new thinking – not by repairing the already tested and quite untrue procedures which have been around for 67 years.
Pakistan has plenty of good people of its own, what it does not have a good procedure, hence the present politicians will get the jackpot each time you to the polls.
Javed Chaudry
=========================================================
What is needed is for the elected MNAs, Senators and MPAs to be put thru a specially designed crash adult literacy program, the program should based on Swiss Finishing Schools model for these bozos to be also introduced to social graces, conduct and deportment, dress sense, table manners and all the rest.
Subject: Re: Issues
There were times when there was no pay for these public reps. Only travel expenses to attend sessions. They were not allowed any mark of distinction on their cars. No extra privilege. Bhutto made them VIPs. Thereafter, there has been no stopping.
Masud
On Sat, Jan 24, 2015 at 9:29 PM, Javed Chaudry <> wrote:
By all means Sir. And another thing, perhaps a minor point, the food made available to the parliamentarians in the parliament cafeteria is subsidized while there are lots of poor and hungry people around. If anything, food should be subsidized for the poor people not the rich and the most affluent and useless category of the society.
For the sake of a mental exercise, suppose if the all the Pakistani politicians are locked out of the parliament and various provincial assemblies for a year, what would be the impact on the economy of Pakistan? The state of Pakistan will save millions of rupees a day, not just out of their salaries and perks but also due to the fact that they no longer have access to the national coffer. Like the tentacles of a giant octopus, their men are sitting in all nooks and crannies of every departments eating away Pakistan in more ways that you can count.
The dynastic politicians and the progress of Pakistan are two entities which negate each other and cannot survive together.
Javed Chaudry
===========================================================
From: Syed Masud ul Hassan [mailto:]
Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2015 10:53 AM
To: JAVED CHAUDRY
Subject: Re: Issues
Chaudhry sahab, I would like to add following conditions also:
Masud
On Sat, Jan 24, 2015 at 12:25 AM, JAVED CHAUDRY <> wrote:
Masud Hassan Sahib, my response was to address Wasti Sahib’s suggestions to allow 300 years for democracy to grow. You are right and I am also fully aware that it can be and has been done almost overnight. I fully agree with that, but not without changing the acceptance criteria for the candidates, hence the changing of the constitution. At a minimum, three requirements must be changed: one is the academic qualification, minimum a Bachelor’s degree (or equivalent, such as military academy education), higher education to be preferred; second, a minimum of 15 years working experience in a responsible position; and the third, Clean bill of financial track record. With these requirements in place, 95% of the present day parliamentarians will be out. When talking about working experience in responsible position, 15 years of being a parliament member as the friend or family member of a dynastic political outfit does not count an acceptable experience – not in my books. I am looking for scientists, engineers, economists, lawyers, accountants, professors, doctors, retired judges, retired military officers etc. to be the members of the parliament. The semiliterate corrupt garbage that we have today cannot build the nation or its democracy.
Javed Chaudry
On Friday, January 23, 2015 1:57 PM, Syed Masud ul Hassan <> wrote:
Chaudhry sahab, why go so far in history. Let us not talk about India, what about Sri Lanka, Malaysia and Vietnam. Germany and Japan were also new to democracy but did not waste a day after peace treaty to get on to democracy. Unless we get rid of the real enemy of democracy, it will remain zameen jumbad na ….
Masud
On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 10:54 PM, JAVED CHAUDRY <> wrote:
Our good friend Wasti Sahib states:
Give Pakistani democracy the same time as was ‘Allowed’ to other decent democracies. Why discriminate and put hurdles before it ?
SHW
I have no reservations about the honesty and integrity of Wasti Sahib in demanding for patience and time that was allowed for other democracies around the world. But I will have to reject his proposal as it is based on assumptions and postulations which applied to other countries centuries ago but do not apply to Pakistan in view of the socio-polity needs and limitations in the 21stcentury. The process of development of democracy in Pakistan cannot be directly compared with the Europe of 16th century after they had experienced the renaissance in Europe during 14th to 17thcenturies. Pakistani society is still unaware of the meanings of renaissance even in the 21st century. Our methods and procedures must meet our own needs and limitations.
If we go by what Wasti Sahib is proposing, it will be akin to developing a motor car in Pakistan today, starting from the point where the original design stood in the late 19th century and then allow this technology to take 100 years to evolve to the current form and standards – In hundred years, we will still be 100 years behind others. Wasti Sahib’s proposal therefore, cannot be considered acceptable.
It took the Europeans several centuries to develop the democracy simply because they did not have a living example to copy from. The democracy, although proposed originally by the Greeks before Christianity, but it was still an abstract thought in Europe until a couple of centuries ago.
Today, Pakistan does not enjoy the political, social and economic freedoms as did the Western Europe during the last three centuries while they were developing their democratic systems. Most of the Western European countries were at par with each other militarily and economically. They had minimal interference in their internal affairs from other countries. They were slowly but steadily improving their economies and level of general education of the public. The growth of population was not as severe as it has been in Pakistan during the last six decades. The upper crust in those countries did have luxurious life but did not steel from the nation’s coffer and deposit it in the Swiss banks. Many of them had additional economic help from the New World as well as their colonies. Also, they were ahead of most other countries of the world in science and technology. In Pakistan, the life is hugely dependent on its friends and neighbours and their own geopolitical, socio-economic and religious interests. The Western Europe, while developing their democracies, did not have to fight CIA, RAW and Saudi Money trying to rearrange social life through themadressas, TTP and dozens of terror groups.
Pakistan therefore, cannot afford the luxury of waiting for three centuries to develop its democracy. We know what the target should be, we also know what kind of people are required to work in the parliament – All we need to do is to re-write the constitution that would serve Pakistan as opposed to the one in use today that serves a few dynastic families and their friends only. In order to develop democracy in Pakistan, the very first step will have to be to remove all the thugs who have a stranglehold on Pakistan’s politics and economy.
Javed Chaudry
On Friday, January 23, 2015 12:47 PM, Imtiaz Akhter <i> wrote:
All of us know that the country is suffering from the defective landlord mulla democracy. Non of us knows how to bring a quick change to a proper workable democratic system, except wait for the time till the people of the country become sensible enough to elect sincere and able representatives.
On Friday, January 23, 2015 10:08 PM, S.Khalid Husain <> wrote:
shams abbas sahib they are slow learners they need more chances!!!!!!
From: shams abbas [mailto:]
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 5:39 PM
To:
Subject: RE: Issues
The PPP has been given four chances.
The PML N three.
In each of these tenures,the performance was worse than the previous one.
Why?Because as correctly pointed out ,’the vision for building solid foundations and Institutions on which Democracy is supposed to deliver does not exist.’
On the contrary,we have seen time and again,that complaints of corruption,rigging in elections and massive, governance blunders, surpass previous records.
We are not arguing against democracy.
We are not pleading for Milirary Rule.
We are not stressing dictatorial rule.
All that is needed is good CORRUPTION FREE GOVERNANCE by competent,highly educated and skilled people who are experts in their fields.Those who have the competence to correct and guide the country on a path from where, there is no turning back.Only going forward,
to improvement, betterment and welfare of the larger number of people.
The argument ,give democracy a chance, therefore is patently an excuse.A cover up for support of corrupt governing Mafias which have taken us down the path, in all facets of development.
Be that of justice,ethics,morality,economy,rule of law,protection of life and property or economy.
If we are in a reverse gear and visibly so,should we just wait,be onlookers?
Or attempt to manage and enforce e change.
In my view we must reject the status quo.We must demand that these failed leaders and parties be held accountable for their monumental mistakes and corruption.I need not go into examples and details of their record of mischief based leadership.
Sixty seven years are more than enough.No more time to be lost.We must demand that the constitution should be implemented in totality which includes articles 62 and 63,indeed all articles which encompass the rights of individuals for being better governed,ruled and given a ‘better present and future.’
Why not?This is our country.
Shams Z Abbas
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2015 07:01:02 -0500
Subject: Re: Issues
It has been seen in Pakistan, that as you give more time to the so-called democracy loving politicians, the more loot and plunder they carry out.
Just review their recent performance during the past 7 years.
After 5-year loot and plunder by Zardari & his PPP coterie, look at the current state of affairs. Nawaz Sharif and his gang have no time to improve governance, they are busy in signing lucrative contracts thru their external agent Saif-ur-Rehman. Just look at the LNG contract, Reko Diq, and other privatization ventures.
If we want to act stupid and close our eyes to the reality on ground, then by the time we wake up, nothing will be left of Pakistan.
We should all understand that these corrupt politicians are using the slogan of democracy not for the betterment of the people but as a shield for their corruption.
KHALED NIZAMI
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 10:53 PM, Haroon Wasti wrote:
Give Pakistani democracy the same time as was ‘Allowed’ to other decent democracies. Why discriminate and put hurdles before it ?
SHW
On Friday, January 23, 2015 5:12 AM, Mahfooz Rahman wrote:
Dear sirs and madams
I agree with the views of Javed Chaudary saheb
Pakistan is an ocean of ignorance , poverty , sickness , unemployment and helplessness . In its midst , there is an island of affluence (through fair means or foul , mostly foul ) knowledge and apathy . The affluent ones’ bearing is unbearable and revolting . The impression to the world is one of pity none the less disgusting.
No matter how many times one shuffles the pack of cards , the same tired ,rotten , crude and foul mouthed people come out as parliamentarians . This is our luck . However in other matters These people are cunning and rotten to the core . However , they to borrow the words from P.G Woodhouse they are made of concrete from the shoulders upwards unless it is tempered with their self aggrandisements .
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 10:46 PM, Syed Masud ul Hassan wrote:
Aziz Beg was editor/owner of a weekly magazine, STAR. That was banned during Ayub’s times. He wrote a book on Pakistan.That was borrowed by some friend but was never returned. The book was also proscribed.
Masud
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 9:50 PM, JAVED CHAUDRY wrote:
Masud Hasaan Sahib,
I fully concur with your second and third paragraphs as well. The real problem is that when we say “we” elected them – who are those who elect them? The 70% of the illiterate masses (assuming there is no rigging)? We are obliged to follow and obey the rulers, only when they are placed in the office legally and fairly. That is not the case in Pakistan, hence its people are under no obligation to accept and obey such rulers.
Yes, I agree, our people should rise, but they don’t and they won’t. They have been part of such system for centuries and they are unable to think for themselves. I do not know who Mr. Aziz Beg is/was, but perhaps he was right in saying what you have quoted.
The bottom line is that I do not believe the thugs in power are in any mood to quit. They will have another sham election and same or similar thugs will be in power once again and the whole cycle of corruption will repeat itself.
The government of the people, by the people, for the people will not materialise in Pakistan unless the election system is designed to be independent of money, the current dynastic party system and unless the police and the judiciary are depoliticised. Short of that, the corrupt system will prevail until a coup takes place or the country disintegrates. No matter how many cycles of such sham elections the country goes through, no positive change will come and a steady deterioration will be a constant feature of the corrupt system.
The people all over the world are getting a short term respite from the expensive petrol, but in Pakistan they are paying twice the usual price, only if they can buy some after a long wait in the line at the petrol station. Who is responsible for this? The (rigged election) elected government – Who else?
Javed Chaudry
On Thursday, January 22, 2015 9:42 AM, Syed Masud ul Hassan <> wrote:
Chaudhry sahab, I think your comments are based on first para only. Please comment on the two other paras, reproduced below.
Masud
Problem is that despite the Constitution, our people are denied those rights by the rulers whom we keep electing repeatedly. We accept whatever is doled out. ‘HAKIM-E-WAQAT KI ITA’AT LAZIM HAI’
Instead of behaving like the subjects of ;Ek tha Badshah’ our people have to rise and snatch the rights given by God and laid down in the Constitution. Time has come to follow Faiz’s “LAZIM HAI ……” The needed spark is not visible as yet. If I still remeber the words of Mr Aziz Beg, “People were perspiring, leaders were conspiring, nation was expiring and alas, none was inspiring”
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 7:05 PM, JAVED CHAUDRY <> wrote:
Masud Sahib, the constitution in Pakistan does not mean a thing to the ordinary public. It serves only the ruling elite. If the constitution was in use the way it is meant to be then people like Sharifs and Zardaris could not have been considered qualified to run for the highest offices. Having a constitution in Pakistan offers no benefit to the people. The ruling elite is simply above it with judiciary and all other governmental instruments equally corrupt, happen to be in their back pocket.
Javed Chaudry
On Thursday, January 22, 2015 5:15 AM, Syed Masud ul Hassan <> wrote:
“Change does not happen it has to be made to happen”,
Khalid sahab, I absolutely agree with your above comment. You have put Saudi Arabia and Pakistan together in one category. There I disagree a bit because our Constitution grants all the rights whereas Saudi, if they have one, does not allow.
Problem is that despite the Constitution, our people are denied those rights by the rulers whom we keep electing repeatedly. We accept whatever is doled out. ‘HAKIM-E-WAQAT KI ITA’AT LAZIM HAI’
Instead of behaving like the subjects of ;Ek tha Badshah’ our people have to rise and snatch the rights given by God and laid down in the Constitution. Time has come to follow Faiz’s “LAZIM HAI ……” The needed spark is not visible as yet. If I still remeber the words of Mr Aziz Beg, “People were perspiring, leaders were conspiring, nation was expiring and alas, none was inspiring”
Masud
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 12:26 PM, S.Khalid Husain <> wrote:
God given rights have to be implemented, as they are in most countries except Muslim countries, and most blatantly not implemented, but denied, in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, one a ‘Fountainhead’ of Islam and the other ‘Citadel’ of Islam, two of most hypocritical countries.
Change does not happen it has to be made to happen, the poor remain poor in Pakistan, the illiterate remain illiterate in Pakistan, minorities remain victimized in Pakistan, corruption remains a fixture, bad governance persists, the only change is much increased bigotry and hatred engendered by the mullas.
From: Syed Masud ul Hassan [mailto:]
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2015 10:49 AM
To: S.Khalid Husain
Subject: Re: Issues
Despite efforts by the ‘great democrat’, blacks got right to vote only a century after end of the Civil War. It took another half a century to elect a half black president. Credit for this cannot be given to what happened more that a century ago. Change was to come with passage of time. Even Kennedy was the first Catholic to become president. Many countries have had very effective women prime ministers and presidents. USA is only now likely to elect a women president.
USA was formed by independent states joining together. When some of the states did not approve of the policies of the central government, they decided to separate and form their own union.
Following were the 5 basic principles of union. Ending of slavery was not included. That was included only in the agenda of Lincoln. Break up took place before he became president. After becoming president, he started the 4 years war to impose his program. I am not going in to merit or demerits of that program but just about principles.
Despite the first principle, our liberals have no objection but hell is being raised against our Objectives Resolution for following the principles from God.
Masud
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 8:44 AM, S.Khalid Husain <> wrote:
In the country of the man who said above, a descendent of slaves, a man of different color, who were cruelly discriminated against and inhumanly treated, has been elected by the people of that country to be their President. The man who used the ‘danda’ to unite the country, to end slavery and injustice in that country, must be resting easy in his grave.
Wonder how those who used the ‘danda’ in our country are resting wherever they are.
From: Syed Masud ul Hassan [mailto:]
Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2015 12:18 AM
To: Khalil Sufi
Subject: Re: Issues
Democracy – “Government of the the people,by the people for the people”
The man who said the above, used history’s biggest ‘danda’ to unify his own nation.
Masud
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 8:42 PM, Khalil Sufi <> wrote:
Mahfooz -It is not the personalities who should matter. Democracy -maybe government of the the people,by the people for the people. Democracy may work for the people who are reasonably educated, intelligent ( we don’t need Phds.), and not a mob that can be led by the Pied Piper of Hamelin Pakistan when it came into existence had laws and rules and, still has, to go by. Do we, including myself follow these. This can be seen on the roads, traffic, encroachment, garbage on roads, getting a driving licence,a passport, utility facilities or any other work connected with any of the government departments. Karachi and Lahore were example of town planning. These cities are bursting and continue to be expanded.. Islamabad was planned by a world renowned town planner Doxiadis, K, P, a Greek architect. Proper public transport does not exist. There is no railway station in the Capital of the Country. Islamabad is loosing its charm as”Islamabad the Beautiful.” It is becoming a commercial city Pakistan has privileged classes the civil service and the military services. Then there is a working class or the common citizens. They exist on day to day basis. Some of this forum members may be living in foreign countries where there are minimum wages. In our part of the Country one can employ a domestic help under Rs.10,000/ pm 24/7 and no leave or any other benefits. They have no pension ( a worker gets a pension of Rs.3,500/ pm), no subsidized education or basic health facilities. The do not get plots at throw away prices.
Has all this happened overnight ! We have all contributed to this mess.
Regards
M, Khalil Sufi
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 6:52 PM, <> wrote:
Issues are lack of resources. Here everyone consumes six times more than his fair share of global resources. Pakistan’s GDP, $1,260, US GDP is $42,000.
Only six percent of farmers work on land, to produce enough food for Americans, and keep some in reserve, in case it is needed around the world.
Naseem Khan
Subject: Re: The Dispossessed Ones
My son , Saad , following the advice given to him by a driver at his firm , got up at 3 AM to get his car filled in . But the nearest petrol pumps were closed . The poor chap again attempted at 7.30 AM . After a wait of one hour , he got it .Thank God . Last evening I phoned him at his offfice specifically to ensure that some petrol may be kept aside for emergencies especially our house is 35 km from Islamabad . Name anything water , gas , electricity and now petrol . Has the previous or the present managed anything ? Governance means delivery . Have they managed to deliver . .
No one in his right mind would wish for martial law . But if governments do not or cannot deliver pray what is the solution ?
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 2:34 PM, Col Naeem wrote:
A government foisted by a criminal NRO, rigged elections, corrupt judiciary and yellow media is not legitimate.
Since this government came through extra-constitutional measures (NRO and violation of Article 62 and 63 to name a few); it could/ should be ousted through extra-constitutional measures; for the viability and security of the state.
Extraordinary situations require extraordinary solutions.
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 1:24 PM, Haroon Wasti wrote:
NO ONE BUT NO ONE has the right to usurp the power
of the 180 million people of Pakistan to dislodge their
elected Govt., Good or even Bad.
It is solely their inherent right and any one interfering in
that right has no place amongst them or in their hearts.
Only the 180 million can bring in any change.
We are aware of our history and know well that those
who tried this trick, not only MIS– — USED our respected
institution but also deceived the nation to fulfill their
own ugly selfish ambitions, leaving the nation worst off
then before , reeling unsteadily for decades later.
No sane person should even dream of such options.
SHW
On Monday, January 19, 2015 8:11 PM, S.Khalid Husain wrote:
Mercifully no mulla is on the list for the interim government or it will be from smoldering tandoor to blazing nightmare.
From: Col Naeem [mailto:
Relevant names with alternate names were decided upon even before the dharnas in July 2014!
On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 12:44 PM, Mahfooz Rahman < wrote:
I am not professional writer nor a political scientest . I write a hobby . However I am enclosing a video . Whether you like or not he speaks truth .http://www.zemtv.com/2015/01/18/goya-with-arsalan-khalid-exclusive-with-zaid-hamid-18th-january/
Regards
Mahfooz
On Mon, Jan 19, 2015 at 12:28 PM, Sadeed Malik <> wrote:
Mahfooz sahib, A very well written narration of recent events, with continued degradation in our country. Many of us have commented, some with solutions. I would like to hear from you what solutions you propose to correct the state of affairs with short and medium term measures; covering a period of about a decade. Regards Sadeed
On Jan 16, 2015, at 7:43 PM, Mahfooz Rahman <> wrote:
THE DISPOSSESSED ONES
If the Zardari years ( 2008-2013) were bad as far as the governance was concerned , the current rule is worse . As a political commentator said aptly he governance in their dictionary means making more metro buses or motorways . In my article “ An Autumn of Bitter Harvest “ , I wrote that I found out that it was immaturity in various phases of ‘democracy ‘ so much so that the common people are beginning to hate the word . Democracy in Pakistan is tantamount to looting the exchequer and exploiting the marginalized people .
On the political horizon a new star , General Raheel Sharif , has emerged shining brightly on the bleak afternoon sky . Ma Sha Allah He is everywhere at the gate of the Army Public School ,Peshawar when it reopened on January 12 shaking hands individually with the children and parents boosting up their morale , on the front meeting soldiers ,meeting the US armed forces top brass , at the CentCom , John Kerry , the US Secretary of State both in Washington as well as Rawalpindi , or David Cameron , the British Prime Minister in London .
Two major events happened in succeeding months ie December 2014 and January 2015 . One event happened in the Army Public School , Peshawar when firing and grenades by the attackers killed 150 persons including 134 children . Another event happened half a globe away in France when two gunmen killed a dozen in an attack on a magazine “ Charlie Hebdo “ . The responses from each were totally different . In the first case , apart from the army which arrived on the spot within minutes when the shooting began and cleared the school from all militants , the response from the Government left much to be desired . The Prime Minister convened an all parties conference the second or the third day instead of taking an urgent action .
Many writers and political commentators wrote comprehensive on the mind boggling event . I minuted that the Concise Oxford Dictionary has no word to describe this bestiality . I also wrote a short story “ Mama I want to go to school . Papa I want to go to school “. As a grandfather I wanted to share with the parents or grandparents my anxiety whether their children would be safe at school regardless of their wishes .
The French response was phenomenal . Beside police action of killing the assailants , French both men and women demonstrated in the major cities . Not only that , the Government gathered forty heads of states and of governments to show the world’s solidarity with France .
I do not trust the politicians . One man who stood out was Imran Khan . However he too failed at the crucial moment for the reasons as mentioned below :-
1 . In Peshawar at the start of the all parties conference , the Prime Minister was caught by the eyes of the camera cutting jokes and he was smiling . That picture went viral . There is no harm in cutting jokes . But the timing was odd . Twenty four hours , the nation had lost its cream . The parents and grandparents had lost their children/grandchildren . It showed the politicians’ apathy .
2 . Imran Khan cancelled the sit in to protest against the rigging in the previous year’s election . Whether he was right or wrong , it appeared to the onlookers that he was tired of the sit ins . One writer named him as Dharna Khan .
3 . His marriage showed indifference to the great loss the nation suffered at the Army Public School , Peshawar . Again I felt that the timing was odd . I discussed the matter with my wife . I told her Imran Khan’s marriage has made a big dent in his popularity graph . Of course I have no estimates. However I feel he has missed the boat .
Be it as may it , the parents of the children of the Army Public School or the people of Pakistan living elsewhere , are fed up of the governance , the law and order . There are many places in various towns and cities which have no water , no electricity , no gas . The latest addition is the non-availability of petrol because a major oil distribution company has no money to pay for the imports In Tharparker , a famine is raging and each day a couple of infants die . Except the army which is camped there and doing all that it can , the Sind Government is nonchalant .
Each day bring bad news for the dispossessed people either of fire in a wood factory , or a bad accident between two speeding buses killing or maiming people . One can go on and on but the list of grievances has appears to have no end .
Mahfooz ur Rahman
Islamabad
January 16, 2015
Pakistan’s Armed Forces are considered as saviours because time and again they have proved to be so.
Whenever there is a crisis in the country, the Armed Forces are called in, whether it be earthquake, floods, terrorism or Pakistan’s integrity & failure as a state.
Pakistan’s Armed Forces is the only institution which is disciplined, trained and well-versed in strategy development.
Now what we are suggesting is that the Higher Judiciary should take the lead in correcting the state of affairs of the country with full support from the Pakistan Armed Forces. Take over by the Armed Forces is not suggested.
KHALED NIZAMI
: Mayraj Fahim <f>
Date: Sat, Jan 24, 2015 at 6:59 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: Issues related to Democracy in Pakistan – this corrupt & exploitative (feudal) system should be dismantled & Replaced by a National Unity Govt of Honest Technocrats
To: kanizami07 <>
Why is Army considered the savior? Bhutto and Nawaz Sharif were in army governments and received their formative development in army governments. What guarantee will not make same mistakes again?
From: kanizami07 <>
To:
Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2015 5:47 PM
Subject: Fwd: Issues related to Democracy in Pakistan – this corrupt & exploitative (feudal) system should be dismantled & Replaced by a National Unity Govt of Honest Technocrats
third, Clean bill of financial track record.
With these requirements in place, 95% of the present day parliamentarians will be out. When talking about working experience in responsible position, 15 years of being a parliament member as the friend or family member of a dynastic political outfit does not count an acceptable experience – not in my books.
I am looking for scientists, engineers, economists, lawyers, accountants, professors, doctors, retired judges, retired military officers etc. to be the members of the parliament. The semi
-
literate corrupt garbage that we have today cannot build the nation or its democracy.
Javed Chaudry
On Fri, Jan 23, 2015 at 10:54 PM, JAVED CHAUDRY <j> wrote:
Pakistan cannot afford the luxury of waiting for three centuries to develop its democracy. We know what the target should be, we also know what kind of people are required to work in the parliament – All we need to do is to re-write the constitution that would serve Pakistan as opposed to the one in use today that serves a few dynastic families and their friends only.
Javed Chaudry
On Thu, Jan 22, 2015 at 7:05 PM, JAVED CHAUDRY <> wrote:
Masud Sahib, the constitution in Pakistan does not mean a thing to the ordinary public. It serves only the ruling elite.
If the constitution was in use the way it is meant to be then people like Sharifs and Zardaris could not have been considered qualified to run for the highest offices. Having a constitution in Pakistan offers no benefit to the people. The ruling elite is simply above it with judiciary and all other governmental instruments equally corrupt, happen to be in their back pocket.
Javed Chaudry
On Wed, Jan 21, 2015 at 2:34 PM, Col Naeem <> wrote:
A government foisted by a criminal NRO, rigged elections, corrupt judiciary and yellow media is not legitimate.
Since this government came through extra-constitutional measures (NRO and violation of Article 62 and 63 to name a few); it could/ should be ousted through extra-constitutional measures; for the viability and security of the state.
Extraordinary situations require extraordinary solutions.
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